For those who have been waiting for an in house three hander Breitling has answered your wishes! A redesigned SO Heritage!

https://www.breitling.com/en/models/sup ... age-ii-42/

with a ceramic bezel no less!

Tudor has told us that Breitling will also adopt a Tudor movement cal. MT5613, but with a Breitling oscillating weight and Breitling's own regulating system, balance spring, and finishes; this will be Breitling caliber B20."[/i]

Soooooo, not really manufacture at all then.

Well Tudors website claims the movement in the Blackbay Chrono is Maunfacture Calibre, despite the above claims that it's a modified B01. So why shouldn't Breitling claim this with the pretty important modifications they make.

My Pelagos with a MT5612 is a fantastic timekeeper - if the MT5613 is alligned to that then I could think of worse movements to collaborate with.

I'm not saying there is anything wrong with the MT5613 at all - quite the opposite in fact as it's a fine movement - I just want manufacturers to be honest and up-front about the origins of their movements and name them accordingly. That way, we buyers who take pleasure from the fact that a watch is built totally in-house know exactly what we're spending our hard-earned on.

I just want manufacturers to be honest and up-front about the origins of their movements and name them accordingly. That way, we buyers who take pleasure from the fact that a watch is built totally in-house know exactly what we're spending our hard-earned on.

Swiss made is a label used to indicate that a product was made in Switzerland.

From 2017, the legal criteria are:

• For food products: 80% of the weight of the raw materials and the essential processing must take place in Switzerland.
• For industrial products: 60% of the manufacturing costs and the essential manufacturing step must occur in Switzerland.
• For services: the company headquarters and administration must be located in Switzerland.

I'm not being naive at all. I'm not talking about where individual parts are made. Very very few manufacturers make all their own parts, and I've been around long enough to know that some parts will no doubt be produced by one or more 3rd parties no matter where they are. What I'm talking about is the fundamental design of the movement being conceived and executed solely by the company claiming to be the manufacturer.

If we're doing definitions then...,

https://www.watch-wiki.net/index.php?ti ... e_movement

.....specifically the line, "This means in short that the movement is a proprietary development and designed and produced in-house."

Take the Zenith El Primero, or the Rolex 3135, or indeed the Breitling B01. All of those were conceived, designed and built by the respective manufacturers. Yes some of the parts may be made elsewhere (or not in the case of the 3135), but the concept, the design, and the build of those movements is executed entirely by Zenith, Rolex and Breitling respectively.

What we have here though is a movement that both Tudor and Breitling are claiming as a manufacture movement. Well if Tudor are changing parts in a B01 and calling it their own, and Breitling are taking an MT5613 and calling it their own after changing a few parts, how is that any different to Breitling taking an ETA 2824, changing a few bits and calling it a B17? IMO it's exactly the same, and yet the B17 is called a "modified ETA 2824", but the B20 is being called "manufacture".

Don't get me wrong - I have no issue with Tudor movements at all. I also have no issue with collaborative work between companies. I just don't like it when companies are not fully up front (or are perhaps less than honest) when it comes to things like this. If it was a collaborative effort, then just say so. Omega did that a few years ago with the 3313 and they called it an "exclusive" movement - meaning not fully in-house as it was a F. Piguet design built by Omega.

I realise this distinction won't mean a thing to guys who don't care what's inside a watch, but for me (and others like me) who enjoying knowing that the entire design of a watch (both inside and out) is the work of that one manufacturer, then distinctions like this are important.