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Well your title is a little misleading, so let's handle a couple of definitions first......

A caliber is a model that a company produces - a comparison would be a Ford Focus, BMW 335i, etc

A movement is a specific example of that caliber - your Ford Focus

An ebauche is simply a movement in kit form, but importantly it does not include mainspring, mainspring barrel or any of the escapement.

If you add the missing pieces to an ebauche then you have a chablon, still in kit form.

So.......

We are really looking at what Breitling does to produce a movement, and even though Swatch provide ebauches, they also provide chablons.

Don't mean to be anal, but this comes up fairly frequently and I want to make sure that future searchers of topics don't get confused.

Now, to try and answer your question, Breitling never reveal specifically which parts they refine / replace, but their processes involve automatically replacing some parts of the chablon / ebauche kit and testing a number of others to tighter tolerances than Swatch group. If those parts fail to meet Breitling's tolerances they are either reworked or refinished. Breitling also finishes the plates and bridges.

Additionally, with the cessation of the supply of ebauches and chablons BReitling are now producing a number of additional pieces of these movements in house which removes the need for any reworking / refinishing because they can simply produce them to their own specifications initially.

Author:	sharkman [ Mon Jan 11, 2010 11:01 pm ]
Post subject:	Ebauche to Caliber??
What are the primary refinements Breitling makes to the 2824-2 and 7750 to create Caliber B17 and B13, respectively? TIA

Author:	Roffensian [ Tue Jan 12, 2010 3:47 am ]
Post subject:	Re: Ebauche to Caliber??
Well your title is a little misleading, so let's handle a couple of definitions first...... A caliber is a model that a company produces - a comparison would be a Ford Focus, BMW 335i, etc A movement is a specific example of that caliber - your Ford Focus An ebauche is simply a movement in kit form, but importantly it does not include mainspring, mainspring barrel or any of the escapement. If you add the missing pieces to an ebauche then you have a chablon, still in kit form. So....... We are really looking at what Breitling does to produce a movement, and even though Swatch provide ebauches, they also provide chablons. Don't mean to be anal, but this comes up fairly frequently and I want to make sure that future searchers of topics don't get confused. Now, to try and answer your question, Breitling never reveal specifically which parts they refine / replace, but their processes involve automatically replacing some parts of the chablon / ebauche kit and testing a number of others to tighter tolerances than Swatch group. If those parts fail to meet Breitling's tolerances they are either reworked or refinished. Breitling also finishes the plates and bridges. Additionally, with the cessation of the supply of ebauches and chablons BReitling are now producing a number of additional pieces of these movements in house which removes the need for any reworking / refinishing because they can simply produce them to their own specifications initially.

Author:	sharkman [ Tue Jan 12, 2010 5:58 am ]
Post subject:	Re: Ebauche to Caliber??
Thanks, not anal at all. Pretty sure I understood the caliber/movement distinction. I appreciate the ebauche/chablon distinction and the rest of the info. Question, does Bretling typically start with an ebauuche or cablon. Because based on my li ited knowledge, if you take the mainspring, barrel, and the entire escapement away, there isn't a whole lot left is there? Thank you again. The more I can understand about the movement in a watch, the more i can apppreciate that timepiece.

Author:	Spartan [ Tue Jan 12, 2010 6:26 am ]
Post subject:	Re: Ebauche to Caliber??
Roffensian wrote: Well your title is a little misleading, so let's handle a couple of definitions first...... A caliber is a model that a company produces - a comparison would be a Ford Focus, BMW 335i, etc A movement is a specific example of that caliber - your Ford Focus An ebauche is simply a movement in kit form, but importantly it does not include mainspring, mainspring barrel or any of the escapement. If you add the missing pieces to an ebauche then you have a chablon, still in kit form. So....... We are really looking at what Breitling does to produce a movement, and even though Swatch provide ebauches, they also provide chablons. Don't mean to be anal, but this comes up fairly frequently and I want to make sure that future searchers of topics don't get confused. Now, to try and answer your question, Breitling never reveal specifically which parts they refine / replace, but their processes involve automatically replacing some parts of the chablon / ebauche kit and testing a number of others to tighter tolerances than Swatch group. If those parts fail to meet Breitling's tolerances they are either reworked or refinished. Breitling also finishes the plates and bridges. Additionally, with the cessation of the supply of ebauches and chablons BReitling are now producing a number of additional pieces of these movements in house which removes the need for any reworking / refinishing because they can simply produce them to their own specifications initially. Thanks Roff

Author:	O2AFAC67 [ Tue Jan 12, 2010 7:13 am ]
Post subject:	Re: Ebauche to Caliber??
Roffensian wrote: ...Breitling never reveal specifically which parts they refine / replace, but their processes involve automatically replacing some parts of the chablon / ebauche kit and testing a number of others to tighter tolerances than Swatch group. If those parts fail to meet Breitling's tolerances they are either reworked or refinished. Breitling also finishes the plates and bridges. Additionally, with the cessation of the supply of ebauches and chablons Breitling are now producing a number of additional pieces of these movements in house which removes the need for any reworking / refinishing because they can simply produce them to their own specifications initially. All good information and quite correct. Although as Roff said the parts refined/replaced are not revealed by Breitling, it is well known that the new balance installed is of glycodur and the new hairspring is of nivarox 1 (1 being the highest grade, lowest is 5) or even anachron. The mainspring in the new barrel is also of nivarox (nivaflex) or anachron assumedly. Some screws in the ebauche are replaced by blued versions. The oscillating weight is decorated with "Côtes de Genève" and signed in 18K gold. Even the raw ebauches Breitling begins with are top grade ( 3 ) also which is obviously a better base for the modifications. Because Breitling submit all their finished movements to COSC for certification (the only major brand in the world to do so), they have literally been rebuilt entirely and fine tuned by Breitling Chronometrie (ex "Kelek", bought by Breitling a decade ago to perform this work as well as develop the inhouse B01) for the certification testing. If you do a Google or Bing search on some of the terms mentioned you will find links to more detailed information about them. Bottom line, the "motor" installed in Breitling timepieces is darn near close to mechanical perfection in the opinion of many, myself included... Best, Ron

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Author:	Roffensian [ Tue Jan 12, 2010 7:19 am ]
Post subject:	Re: Ebauche to Caliber??
O2AFAC67 wrote: The mainspring in the new barrel is also of nivarox (nivaflex) or anachron assumedly. Correct. O2AFAC67 wrote: Even the raw ebauches Breitling begins with are top grade ( 3 ) also which is obviously a better base for the modifications. Grade 3 or grade 4 for the ebauches that have four different grades. Thanks for adding the details Ron - invaluable as ever.

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