The Breitling Watch Source Forums

Very nice review. Thanks.

I love these big case vintage B's.
They sit suprisingly well on the wrist for something that
gives a Panerai a run for it's money.

Thanks Yaffle,

Good to see at least one person appreciated my review!

BTW, thanks for the link to the ’73 catalogue on Chuck’s site. I hadn’t noticed the ’73 catalogue before – what a year! What awesome chronographs! It’s ironic that automatic chronographs reached their initial apex just as the quartz re(de)volution got into full swing.

I agree how well the big case Navis wear. I’ve often read about concerns with big watches and cuffed shirts, but these beasts sit so flat it’s never a problem.

I’d like to know more about the history of the big case Navi design. These chronographs were certainly ahead of their time, and if you get one in mint condition, they hold their own when compared to modern pieces.

You're welcome Carlos. Cheers for posting it.

Yes, even though I've had Chuck's website in my bookmarks for years, I only just
flagged the 73 catalogue.

I'll have a GMT and a large case Navi with the Venus 178 please.

Here's a few quick and dirty (pipecleaner) wristshots of my Superocean,
I adore this watch and think it could give any modern watch a run for
it's money.

Dude!

That Superocean is outta sight man!!!!!!!!

From what I’ve read, they a very, very rare. The jumbo subdials and extra orangeness of the Superocean take it to another level. Even from 20m away people would notice that and think you’re on a Cousteau mission.

Hang onto that – not that you’d ever sell it, but unless the market totally tanks, I believe such pieces will approach seventies Daytona prices one day. There are too few mint big case Navis out there (especially the special models like the Superocean), and they are too cool not to develop a cult following. I think there are two reasons why such pieces have been undervalued:

1) Historically they really were ahead of their time – perhaps a bit too much back in the day.

2) They don’t stand up well to rigorous treatment – the bezel and the movement are a bit delicate. Most of the Breitling 1806s I’ve seen look quite rough.

But in the era of big watches, mint big case Navis from the seventies certainly are gathering attention as something very special.

Great article!

I too love the old big case Breitlings. I just finished servicing my '69 Cosmo. After some serious work on the old Cal. 11, I got it running at about six seconds per week! Of course, I don't expect it to hold that after a few weeks on my wrist.

I keep telling the wife that a new Cosmo would be a nice birthday or Christmas gift, but I would probably still wear the 1809 most of the time.

_________________
1809 Cosmonaute
1903 Navi
Navi Olympus
Super Avenger

Thanks, it's NOS back in the day when ewatch had them.

Wish I'd bought more, but I blinked and they vanished, the only drag with it is that it's
so mint I'm a bit hesitant to wear it often. Now if there was a re-issue!

I think the Venus powered Navi is a good one to go for as a more regular wearer.
More robust than the Cal 12. It would be some serious heavy metal with the bracelet as well. Like you say though, finding one in great shape is hard, the bezel is always worn and don't even try and find the crystal for it.

Did you see the huge collection that was posted a while back.
Must have been close to the whole series.

I wonder if the size came as a reaction to Heuer bringing out things like the Monaco and
the Silverstone and Omega with the Ploprof?

Excellent! – the Cosmos are great. I missed out on one a couple of years back – it was NOS, and the numerals were in amazing condition. They have the best hands out of the whole range.

Did you do the work yourself? That Heuer Technical Manual on Chuck’s old site would no doubt be a handy reference. Do you know of any other reference material out there in cyberspace which deals with these movements?

I also like the 7806, especially on those bracelets.

Yes, I did see Jo Siffert’s collection – you may know he has a website dedicated to these watches. Obviously a serious collector - more photos please!

As for the size and competing with Heuer and Omega, that’s an interesting thing to consider. It seems to me that part of the large case can be attributed to the geared bezel mechanism, but there was a bit of a trend to larger watches, and it is possible to scale the whole thing down. But I'm glad they didn't!

Yes, I do my own work. I'm a watchmaker.

I was unaware of the reference material on Chuck's site. If you have a URL to the site, I would appreciate getting it. I know of no other reference material other than a Timezone article on the Hamilton/Buren. It gives a pretty good description of the pitfalls to avoid when reassembling the movement. There are some differences because the watch in the article does not have a chrono section, but they are minimal.

The rotor is the weak link in these and there are no more available. My parts source does not even have any used ones. He purchased the entire Hamilton stock of spares for this movement series. Included was a bunch of used rotors and barrels. Apparently, Hamilton replaced them as a part of their normal service. I've never looked at a rotor to see if it would be difficult to repair. I guess it won't be too long before somebody has to approach it.

_________________
1809 Cosmonaute
1903 Navi
Navi Olympus
Super Avenger

http://chronomaddox.com/heuer/manuals/m ... e.html#Top

http://www.onthedash.com/docs/Project99.html

http://onthedash.com/docs/ChronomaticMovements.html

http://www.lesmala.net/jean-michel/navi ... omatic.htm

Onthedash is a heuer dedicated site. They have written some nice articles on the Call 11/12.



Have you tried Watchco in Australia? I sourced some parts from them in the past, but it was a few years ago.



Wow - I wasn't aware of the new gearing mechanism, so it makes sense from that technical perspective. Still think it was also a "fashion" move as well. Breitling
by the end of the Sixties and into the Seventies were making pretty big watches compared to a lot of other brands. Tool watches were getting bigger, badder and bolder.
Omega's flightmaster/ploprof. Got to love some of those Behemoth Seventies Dive watches.

Cue gratuitous Seventies dive watch picture!

Yes,

The serviceability concerns me. I don’t know - as last resort is there the option of having parts custom made? I do know of some precision machining companies. But that could be very expensive.

I think the last batch of cal. 11/12s went into a hundred or so Helmut Sinn chronos with a display back a couple of years ago. Albert Wajs told me he can’t get any further movements.

There is a certain logic in purchasing a second piece with the cal. 11/12…but then that piece would have to be a nice piece too, maybe a Monaco, and then that would require a third piece from which to cannibalise parts…

Even for a non-watchmaker like myself, the chrono section on these things looks difficult. I understand they would often swap out the whole assembly if there was a problem.

Oh yes, the geared mechanism is very cool – there’s an interesting picture from the patent at www.lesmala.net. You can see how it adds to the diameter of the case. But it may have been driven from the fact that Breitling wanted to make a huge case like many other brands and tasked it’s designers to do something useful with the space.

If your Superocean is like other big case Navis, you will notice that the inner bezel ring turns at a ratio of 1.2 to 1 revolutions.

I think the main rationale for the geared mechanism was water resistance, but the gearing ratio also has the benefit of slightly speeding up the calculating process. This was no doubt appreciated by the owners of these pieces – jet pilots & legitimate business men in their DeTomaso Mangustas, calculating the best way to work in mistresses 2 and 3 during a quick visit to St Tropez.

I like that Fifty Fathoms. I’m sure one day I will acquire a silver dialled Doxa Searambler from the seventies.

Thanks Carlos,



I like the Doxa's, always flirted with a vintage one. Have you seen the website for them?



I'm seeing a picture in my head of this Seventies Breitling Man...